Even Thomas Jefferson Knew!
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Thread: Even Thomas Jefferson Knew!

  1. #1
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    Exclamation Even Thomas Jefferson Knew!

    Quoted in part from Thomas Jefferson and the Ground Zero Mosque

    President Obama and other supporters of the Ground Zero Mosque appeal to our nation’s “founding,” in particular Thomas Jefferson. Here are some additional comments the President made on August 14 in reference to Jefferson:

    And tonight, we are reminded that Ramadan is a celebration of a faith known for great diversity. And Ramadan is a reminder that Islam has always been a part of America. The first Muslim ambassador to the United States, from Tunisia, was hosted by President Jefferson, who arranged a sunset dinner for his guest because it was Ramadan—making it the first known iftar[4] at the White House, more than 200 years ago.

    First, Islam is not noted for its religious diversity. Christians cannot evangelize in Muslim countries. Churches are burned while police do nothing. Muslims who convert to another religion can be executed. Even the presence of the Bible is prohibited by our own military and the behest of Islamic officials when American soldiers are deployed in Muslim nations:

    Bibles were confiscated and destroyed after Qatar-based Al Jazeer television showed soldiers at a Bible class on a base with a stack of Bibles translated into the local Pashto and Dari languages. The U.S. military forbids its members on active duty—including those based in places like Afghanistan—from trying to convert people to another religion. Reuters quotes Maj. Jennifer Willis at the Bagram Air Base, north of Kabul, who said “I can now confirm that the Bibles shown on Al Jazeera’s clip were, in fact, collected by the chaplains and later destroyed. They were never distributed.”[5]

    Second, President Obama’s favorable appeal to Jefferson is only part of the story. The Koran’s peace initiatives are Orwellian: “Submission to Islam is peace.” Peace is the absence of any religious or political opposition. This is the indisputable history of Islam as Paul Johnson writes:

    Koranic teaching that the faith or “submission” can be, and in suitable circumstances must be, imposed by force, has never been ignored. On the contrary, the history of Islam from Arabia was followed by the rapid conquest of North Africa, the invasion and virtual conquest of Spain, and a thrust into France that carried the crescent to the gates of Paris. It took half a millennium or reconquest to expel the Moslems from Western Europe. The Crusades, far from being an outrageous prototype of Western imperialism, as is taught in most of our schools, were a mere episode in a struggle that has lasted 1,400 years and were one of the few occasions when Christians took the offensive to regain the “occupied territories” of the Holy Land.[6]

    What did Jefferson learn from his study of the Koran? As early as 1786, Jefferson, who was serving as the ambassador to France, and John Adams, the Ambassador to Britain, met in London with Ambassador Abdrahaman, the Dey of Tripoli’s ambassador to Britain, in an attempt to negotiate a peace treaty based on Congress’ vote of funding. Peace would come at a price. If America wanted “temporary peace,” a one-year guarantee, it would cost $66,000 plus a 10% commission. “Everlasting peace” was a bargain at $160,000 plus the obligatory commission. This only applied to Tripoli. Other Muslim nations would also have to be paid. The amount came to $1.3 million. But there was no assurance that the treaties would be honored. In vain Jefferson and Adams tried to argue that America was not at war with Tripoli. In what way had the U.S provoked the Muslims, they asked? Ambassador Abdrahaman went on to explain “the finer points of Islamic jihad” to the Koranically challenged Jefferson and Adams. In a letter to John Jay, Jefferson wrote the following:

    The Ambassador answered us that it was founded on the Laws of their Prophet, that it was written in their Koran, that all nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, and that every Musselman [Muslim] who should be slain in battle was sure to go to Paradise.[7]

    Abdrahaman was paraphrasing the Koran’s “rules of engagement” found in the 47 Surah: “Whenever you encounter the ones who disbelieve [during wartime], seize them by their necks until once you have subdued them, then tie them up as prisoners, either in order to release them later on, or also to ask for ransom, until war lays down her burdens.” Unless a nation submitted to an Islamic nation, whether it was the aggressor or not, that nation was by definition at war with Islam. Jihad means “to submit.” A non-aggressing nation is still at war with Islam as long as it hasn’t embraced Islam. Islam’s goal is to conquer the world, either by the submission of one’s will or by Allah’s sword.[8]

    When President Jefferson refused to increase the tribute demanded by the Islamists, Tripoli declared war on the United States. A United States navy squadron, under Commander Edward Preble, blockaded Tripoli from 1803 to 1805. After rebel soldiers from Tripoli, led by United States Marines, captured the city of Derna, the Pasha of Tripoli signed a treaty promising to exact no more tribute.

    President Obama is not the first person who has tried to whitewash Islam’s history with America. Rep. Keith Ellison (D-Minn.), a Muslim, took his constitutional oath on Jefferson’s copy of the Koran. How ironic given Jefferson’s disdain for Islam’s principles. There’s a reason the “Marines’ Hymn” begins with these words:

    From the Halls of Montezuma,

    to the shores of Tripoli.

    The line “To the shores of Tripoli” refers to the First Barbary War, specifically the Battle of Derne in 1805. Jefferson, embroiled in a war with Islamic terrorists in his day, commented, “Too long, for the honor of nations, have those Barbarians been suffered [permitted] to trample on the sacred faith of treaties, on the rights and laws of human nature!”[9] Little has changed since Jefferson’s day. The Muslims of the Ground Zero Mosque will say one thing and mean another.
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century
    "Don't be so open minded that your brains fall out!" Father John Corapi.

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  3. #2
    Stop beating a dead horse.


    If you voted for Kerry in 2004, Obama wouldn't be in office. What do you think about that?

  4. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative Liberal View Post
    Stop beating a dead horse.


    If you voted for Kerry in 2004, Obama wouldn't be in office. What do you think about that?
    and we would have surrendered to the Muslims... what do you think of that....
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century
    "Don't be so open minded that your brains fall out!" Father John Corapi.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Sheldon View Post
    and we would have surrendered to the Muslims on 912... what do you think of that....
    Doubt it, but we would have saved the surplus that Clinton procured during his term by not wandering around in the deserts of Iraq! Any President would have gone into Afghanistan, your boy Georgie W took it a little too far.


    And what do you mean by surrender? What have we accomplished? Did we find WMD's? No. Did we find Osama? No. Did we go off on a tangent and kill Saddam and his family to cover-up the screw-up? Check. Have we lost a bunch of kids in the desert to people who do not care about life? Check. All in all I would say it was a large waste of time and resources.

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative Liberal View Post
    Doubt it, but we would have saved the surplus that Clinton procured during his term by not wandering around in the deserts of Iraq! Any President would have gone into Afghanistan, your boy Georgie W took it a little too far.
    Clinton got a surplus by gutting the military and clandestine services. The Muslims looked at that and saw opportunity. And so it goes... We are now engaged in the most recent of the crusades and until we get serious it will continue with this back and forth crap.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by shooter2 View Post
    Clinton got a surplus by gutting the military and clandestine services. The Muslims looked at that and saw opportunity. And so it goes... We are now engaged in the most recent of the crusades and until we get serious it will continue with this back and forth crap.
    What does the military have to do with the terrorist attacks in New York and DC? The Bush administration was notified months before 911 that there was going to be an attack and Al Qaeda would probably administer it. This was not a war for the military, after all we rolled Baghdad in three weeks. Discretion was the key, and W **** the bed. 2 billion a week in the Middle-East while women and children starve on our streets!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative Liberal View Post
    What does the military have to do with the terrorist attacks in New York and DC? The Bush administration was notified months before 911 that there was going to be an attack and Al Qaeda would probably administer it. This was not a war for the military, after all we rolled Baghdad in three weeks. Discretion was the key, and W **** the bed. 2 billion a week in the Middle-East while women and children starve on our streets!
    you better re read the history texts Clinton had to opportunity and blew it, Bush was on the wind up when this happened, and yes they did find WMD's Saw the photos at the gun shows that were taken by our troupes of them, Missiles, chemicals, aircraft all buried, just is the liberal media buried it, and who knows what else is buried under all that sand.... I have a nephew over there and they were still finding stuff right to the point they closed the base....
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century
    "Don't be so open minded that your brains fall out!" Father John Corapi.

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by shooter2 View Post
    Clinton got a surplus by gutting the military and clandestine services. The Muslims looked at that and saw opportunity. And so it goes... We are now engaged in the most recent of the crusades and until we get serious it will continue with this back and forth crap.
    Yes we need to get serious and end this. Strength is the only thing that the Islamists understand.

    PRO-LIFE FROM CONCEPTION TO NATURAL DEATH
    TO HIM THEREFORE WHO KNOWETH TO DO GOOD AND DOETH IT NOT, TO HIM IT IS SIN. HOLY BIBLE]

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Sheldon View Post
    you better re read the history texts Clinton had to opportunity and blew it, Bush was on the wind up when this happened, and yes they did find WMD's Saw the photos at the gun shows that were taken by our troupes of them, Missiles, chemicals, aircraft all buried, just is the liberal media buried it, and who knows what else is buried under all that sand.... I have a nephew over there and they were still finding stuff right to the point they closed the base....
    ********. No nuclear weapons were found. period. Stop beating around the bush. All you have are these tangents to rely on because the reason for invading Iraq was fabricated. The United States buries chemical weapons in the Atlantic Ocean, thats a fact. This liberal media **** is not true either, if they found nuclear weapons, believe me it would be on the front page of the NY times regardless of party affiliation. Missiles and aircraft are not WMDS. No warheads were found, the pitiful cache of scuds from the Gulf war and mustard gas hardly qualify as WMD's.

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative Liberal View Post
    .. the pitiful cache of scuds from the Gulf war and mustard gas hardly qualify as WMD's.
    What, no smoking gun? Puhleeez. Saddam had plenty of time to ship stuff out, most of which the Iranians are using today. Labs with equipment painted a clear picture. WMD is not limited to nuke stuff. They were also working on advanced bio-chem programs, not just mustard gas.

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