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Thread: New School Prayor

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Boomboy007 View Post
    The supreme court was just joking back in 1962 and 1963 when they "supposedly" banned it. They were just jokin', I guess.

    Man, you are ridiculous.

    +1. Good one. Perhaps in his parrallel universe it is that way.
    By faith Noah,being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear,prepared an ark to the saving of his house;by the which he condemned the world,and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith Heb.11:7

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  3. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Boomboy007 View Post
    The supreme court was just joking back in 1962 and 1963 when they "supposedly" banned it. They were just jokin', I guess.

    Man, you are ridiculous.
    Apparently you don't know the difference between praying and proselytizing. The SCOTUS did not prohibit anyone from praying in a public school. Pray all you want. Just do it the way God intended. The way Matt described:

    But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

    Mathew 6:6

    Of course, that assumes you believe in the Word. Maybe you don't. In which case go ahead and pray the Satan way - outloud and proud - Satan loves it.

  4. #13
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    There is a difference between preventing state sponsored schools from mandating praying or forcing children to listen to other people pray and preventing prayer.

    For anyone who didn't know, "under God" was not originally part of the Pledge and no mention of "God" was on the original U.S. Currency.

  5. #14
    For those who think the founding fathers didn't think Christianity was the basis for this country take a look at the following:

    “ The general principles upon which the Fathers achieved independence were the general principals of Christianity… I will avow that I believed and now believe that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and attributes of God.”
    “[July 4th] ought to be commemorated as the day of deliverance by solemn acts of devotion to God Almighty.”

    –John Adams in a letter written to Abigail on the day the Declaration was approved by Congress

    “Why is it that, next to the birthday of the Savior of the world, your most joyous and most venerated festival returns on this day [the Fourth of July]?" “Is it not that, in the chain of human events, the birthday of the nation is indissolubly linked with the birthday of the Savior? That it forms a leading event in the progress of the Gospel dispensation? Is it not that the Declaration of Independence first organized the social compact on the foundation of the Redeemer's mission upon earth? That it laid the cornerstone of human government upon the first precepts of Christianity"?

    John Quincy Adams--1837, at the age of 69, when he delivered a Fourth of July speech at Newburyport, Massachusetts.

    “ God governs in the affairs of man. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without His aid? We have been assured in the Sacred Writings that except the Lord build the house, they labor in vain that build it. I firmly believe this. I also believe that, without His concurring aid, we shall succeed in this political building no better than the builders of Babel”

    Benjamin Franklin –Constitutional Convention of 1787 | original manuscript of this speech

    “In circumstances as dark as these, it becomes us, as Men and Christians, to reflect that whilst every prudent measure should be taken to ward off the impending judgments, …at the same time all confidence must be withheld from the means we use; and reposed only on that God rules in the armies of Heaven, and without His whole blessing, the best human counsels are but foolishness… Resolved; …Thursday the 11th of May…to humble themselves before God under the heavy judgments felt and feared, to confess the sins that have deserved them, to implore the Forgiveness of all our transgressions, and a spirit of repentance and reformation …and a Blessing on the … Union of the American Colonies in Defense of their Rights [for which hitherto we desire to thank Almighty God]…That the people of Great Britain and their rulers may have their eyes opened to discern the things that shall make for the peace of the nation…for the redress of America’s many grievances, the restoration of all her invaded liberties, and their security to the latest generations."

    John Hancock - "A Day of Fasting, Humiliation and Prayer, with a total abstinence from labor and recreation. Proclamation on April 15, 1775"


    This is only a few examples. But I believe it shows this country was built on Christian principles.

  6. #15
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    For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan .When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours - Stephen Roberts

  7. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Boomboy007 View Post
    The supreme court was just joking back in 1962 and 1963 when they \"supposedly\" banned it. They were just jokin\', I guess.

    Man, you are ridiculous.
    boom, you can\'t tell people they are ridiculous over at the ranch. Why do you do it here?

  8. #17
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    That piece misses so many supporting quotes such as:
    "Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed by inserting "Jesus Christ," so that it would read "A departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;" the insertion was rejected by the great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mohammedan, the Hindoo and Infidel of every denomination.

    Source: Thomas Jefferson, "The Virginia Legislature, Review and Reform of the Law," in Autobiography.

    "Christianity neither is, nor ever was a part of the common law."

    Source: Letter of Thomas Jefferson to Dr. Thomas Cooper, February 10, 1814.
    just a couple of his not mentioned there.

    The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history. Although the detail of the formation of the American governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses.
    -- John Adams, "A Defence of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America"
    One of many John Adams quotes to the point that this is Country was founded on reason and sense, not religion.

    I have found Christian dogma unintelligible. Early in life I absented myself from Christian assemblies.
    -- Benjamin Franklin, quoted from Victor J Stenger, Has Science Found God? (2001)
    He doesn't seem so Christian in that quote

    Plenty more quotes from the "supporting" ones mentioned above as well as other founders of this country.

    Just to throw this in, excerpt from an official treaty of the United States ratified in the 1790's by Congress unanimously and signed by President John Adams:
    As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion,—as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen,—and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.

  9. #18
    There's no argument that the founding fathers did not want a government based on religion (like some Arab countries who's government is run on Sharia law). This does not eliminate the fact that they founded this country on Christian principles. This is shown time and time again in their own words if you research their quotes on religion. True the Constitution was written to prevent a Church take over of the government, however, it was not written to remove any evidence of religion. Go ahead bring up "separation of Church and state" but first show me where that's written in the Constitution.

  10. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronwill View Post
    There's no argument that the founding fathers did not want a government based on religion (like some Arab countries who's government is run on Sharia law). This does not eliminate the fact that they founded this country on Christian principles. This is shown time and time again in their own words if you research their quotes on religion. True the Constitution was written to prevent a Church take over of the government, however, it was not written to remove any evidence of religion. Go ahead bring up "separation of Church and state" but first show me where that's written in the Constitution.
    Even though less than 10 years after the U.S. Constitution was ratified the U.S. Congress and President (many of whom signed the Constitution or were related to people who signed it and lived at that time) signed an official document stating that the U.S. was not founded on the Christian religion you make this statement? Do you know of any official United States document that contradicts it?

  11. #20
    Uh...before we start arguing about whether the U.S. was founded on Christianity, shouldn't we first argue about which version of Christianity?

    Or should we just let Glenn Beck make the call - he seems to have appointed himself as the decider of who is and who isn't a real Christian:


    "People aren't recognizing his version of Christianity," Glenn Beck on Fox News commenting on President's Obama's religious beliefs.

    And this from a Mormon no less. Are people "buying" Glenn's version? If so, how much are they paying?

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