S.308 (restaurant carry) debate from 4/17/13 - Page 28
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Thread: S.308 (restaurant carry) debate from 4/17/13

  1. Quote Originally Posted by FN1910 View Post
    If a gas station is out of gas because the tanker is delayed it is still a gas station and has to follow the regulations for the maintenance of the underground tanks. If a place that serves alcoholic beverages cannot sell them on Sunday they do not have to remove all the bottles from the building until Monday. They still have to follow all regulations about storage etc. until Monday. If the pharmacy department of Walgreens closes at 6 pm on Saturday but the store remains open until 10 then it is still a drug store. I will also throw in a few dollars for your defense and place a bid on your guns just like John Canuck.
    I've gone over my posts once or twice and am still missing the part where I must have said that I am carrying into the restaurant on Sunday regardless of what our determination is here. All I'm doing is just seeing if an indisputable argument could be made that could allow carry into restaurants on Sundays. Pardon me. I'll go back to playing the fearful gov't subject now.

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  3. #272
    "What if the owner decided on a particular Sunday that when Monday rolls around they aren't going to serve alcohol anymore. At what point does it become legal to carry into that restaurant? The law doesn't mention any type of grace period. Do they have to stop severing 7 days, 30 days...1 day? "

    I don't know, but my guess would be that if they cancelled their liquor license (I don't have time to look up the correct term right now, but the permit or license that allows them to sell alcohol for on site consumption), then they are no longer in the business of selling alcohol for onsite consumption.

    Since we are engaging in strictly academic conversation, how do you know if an establishment is in the business of selling alcohol? If you walk in, is there a sign or some other indicator (aside from the people sitting around drinking) that tells you this place has the permission of the county to sell alcohol to be consumed on site?

  4. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by hp-hobo View Post
    Really? In that case, you're in entirely the wrong place having entirely the wrong conversation. You seem confused about the difference between a right and a privilege, as is most of the population. As long as you are carrying pursuant to a CWP, you are exercising a privilege. After all, exercising a right doesn't require you to submit to government mandated training and taxation, carry a government mandated permission slip and then be restricted by government set limits on when and where you may exercise it.
    I'm sorry, are you indicating that carrying a firearm is a privilege?
    Quote Originally Posted by Deanimator View Post
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  5. Quote Originally Posted by John Canuck View Post
    "What if the owner decided on a particular Sunday that when Monday rolls around they aren't going to serve alcohol anymore. At what point does it become legal to carry into that restaurant? The law doesn't mention any type of grace period. Do they have to stop severing 7 days, 30 days...1 day? "

    I don't know, but my guess would be that if they cancelled their liquor license (I don't have time to look up the correct term right now, but the permit or license that allows them to sell alcohol for on site consumption), then they are no longer in the business of selling alcohol for onsite consumption.

    Since we are engaging in strictly academic conversation, how do you know if an establishment is in the business of selling alcohol? If you walk in, is there a sign or some other indicator (aside from the people sitting around drinking) that tells you this place has the permission of the county to sell alcohol to be consumed on site?
    I thought someone might make the argument as to whether you could carry or not by if they have a liquor license. But the problem with that logic is, the law says "a person convicted of carrying a pistol or firearm into a business which SELLS alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine..."

    So what if I were a restaurant owner, I didn't want to sell alcohol at all, but I wanted to get my liquor license for the hell of it? I don't sell it as the law says, I just have my liquor license. The law does not state anything about whether or not the business must not have a liquor license.

    What if the law tells me that on Sunday, I cannot sell alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine? I have my liquor license and alcohol in stock, but on that particular day, I do not SELL alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine as the law says.

    Like I say, I'm just trying to see if a strong enough argument could be made. I'm not intending on breaking the law or testing it out, so don't anyone reply with the same message that we have now heard twice already: "I'll donate to your defense charges and place a bid on your guns..."

  6. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnerbob View Post
    I'm sorry, are you indicating that carrying a firearm is a privilege?
    Clearly, reading comprehension is not your strong suit. If you can't figure out the answer to that question based on either that single post or within the context of the thread, I probably wouldn't be able to explain the answer to you anyway.
    "I believe we should achieve a national standard on gun control, and that standard should be none whatsoever."

  7. #276
    Your previous question was about a business owner that sold alcohol (and presumably had a license to do so?) and decided not to sell alcohol anymore. Now, your scenario is of a business owner that has liquor license, but doesn't sell liquor?

    I don't have an answer for you. Perhaps one of your law professors can help. Let us know what you find out. Good luck.

  8. #277
    So anyway, South Carolina ranks 11th in gun thefts, and they want you to leave one in your car when you go into a restaurant? Crazy --> Blog

  9. Quote Originally Posted by John Canuck View Post
    Your previous question was about a business owner that sold alcohol (and presumably had a license to do so?) and decided not to sell alcohol anymore. Now, your scenario is of a business owner that has liquor license, but doesn't sell liquor?

    I don't have an answer for you. Perhaps one of your law professors can help. Let us know what you find out. Good luck.
    I said the latter scenario because you said that if they canceled their liquor license then they were no longer in the business of selling alcohol. So you made it sound as if whether or not the business had a liquor license was the deciding factor. So I simply pointed out that a business could theoretically have a liquor license, but if they don't sell alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine then you could carry in that restaurant because the law mentions nothing about licenses, it only mentions the action of selling. So how would that be any different than if that action is not happening on a particular day?

    My point with the former scenario was to ask what the difference is in not allowing alcohol to be served on Sundays, and a restaurant owner saying announcing to his customers that he will no longer serve alcohol starting on Tuesday, and so you carry in that restaurant on that Tuesday because they no longer serve alcohol. But then Tuesday night the owner decided he wants to start selling alcohol again so he starts back up on Wednesday. There was 1 day there where they didn't sell alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine so carrying would have been legal, but once the action of selling started again it is no longer legal...

  10. #279
    Quote Originally Posted by AndeyHall View Post
    I said the latter scenario because you said that if they canceled their liquor license then they were no longer in the business of selling alcohol. So you made it sound as if whether or not the business had a liquor license was the deciding factor. So I simply pointed out that a business could theoretically have a liquor license, but if they don't sell alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine then you could carry in that restaurant because the law mentions nothing about licenses, it only mentions the action of selling. So how would that be any different than if that action is not happening on a particular day?

    My point with the former scenario was to ask what the difference is in not allowing alcohol to be served on Sundays, and a restaurant owner saying announcing to his customers that he will no longer serve alcohol starting on Tuesday, and so you carry in that restaurant on that Tuesday because they no longer serve alcohol. But then Tuesday night the owner decided he wants to start selling alcohol again so he starts back up on Wednesday. There was 1 day there where they didn't sell alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine so carrying would have been legal, but once the action of selling started again it is no longer legal...
    I was speculating on a hypothetical scenario which keeps changing. You're asking a question (a series or meandering questions actually) that won't provide you with the answer you seek. Good luck in your search.

    So that's a crazy blog post about all the gun thefts from cars, eh?

  11. #280
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    Since we are doing so many "what ifs" I will resurrect my age old rant.

    South Carolina like 48 other states follow English law. Meaning for something to be illegal it must be stated.

    On the SLED website it lists places where you may not carry concealed. Restaurants selling alcohol for consumption is not on it. Therefore not illegal. Well then we get to the law ending in 465: An additional penalty will be given for illegally carrying a handgun in an establishment that sells alcohol for consumption.

    Now for me the key words are illegally and additionally.. IMO they are not talking about CWP it is NOT under the SLED section on CWP. The law covers all crimes. Thus if an event takes place where a illegal handgun is used it is subject to punishment, of course. There will be an ADDITIONAL penalty if it happens in an establishment selling alcohol. A person with a CWP will NOT be carrying illegally since in the SLED section it does not make it illegal.

    And no, I do not wish to be the test case. A few years ago Grassroots SC pulled their endeavor to get "restaurant carry" changed because they realized, so they said, that it was not really illegal. Then some moron asked the AG for his "opinion" and he said he interrupted it to mean no restaurant carry. It was an opinion NOT law made us go backward never the less.

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