This really, REALLY has me pissed off! (Kershaw Co.)
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Thread: This really, REALLY has me pissed off! (Kershaw Co.)

  1. #1
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    This really, REALLY has me pissed off! (Kershaw Co.)

    I mean, can a man no longer protect what's his?!

    Sheriff: 'It's Unfortunate All Around For Everybody Involved'

  2.   
  3. He had everything protected of his at the point they ran away. I agree with the sheriff that he did everything right up to the point of pulling the trigger. There was no threat of bodily harm or death as the article does not state the criminals were carrying weapons and it does not state whether or not the homeowner thought they did either. If they had weapons, then maybe there would be a case for shooting in case they turned as they ran to shoot at him, but that does not appear to be the case. Maybe will a jury will see it different.

  4. #3
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    OK. All points you made are understood.

    However, I see this as waving the green flag to criminals & saying, "Hey, if you're caught, just run away. The person catching you can do nothing to you. Keep what you stole. Sell as quickly as possible to make a profit."

    What can a citizen do to stop these people in their tracks?!

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by nca_mm View Post
    What can a citizen do to stop these people in their tracks?!
    Well - this is the law in Washington state:
    RCW 9A.16.020: Use of force


    RCW 9A.16.020
    Use of force—When lawful.
    The use, attempt, or offer to use force upon or toward the person of another is not unlawful in the following cases:
    (1) Whenever necessarily used by a public officer in the performance of a legal duty, or a person assisting the officer and acting under the officer's direction;
    (2) Whenever necessarily used by a person arresting one who has committed a felony and delivering him or her to a public officer competent to receive him or her into custody;
    (3) Whenever used by a party about to be injured, or by another lawfully aiding him or her, in preventing or attempting to prevent an offense against his or her person, or a malicious trespass, or other malicious interference with real or personal property lawfully in his or her possession, in case the force is not more than is necessary;
    (4) Whenever reasonably used by a person to detain someone who enters or remains unlawfully in a building or on real property lawfully in the possession of such person, so long as such detention is reasonable in duration and manner to investigate the reason for the detained person's presence on the premises, and so long as the premises in question did not reasonably appear to be intended to be open to members of the public;
    (5) Whenever used by a carrier of passengers or the carrier's authorized agent or servant, or other person assisting them at their request in expelling from a carriage, railway car, vessel, or other vehicle, a passenger who refuses to obey a lawful and reasonable regulation prescribed for the conduct of passengers, if such vehicle has first been stopped and the force used is not more than is necessary to expel the offender with reasonable regard to the offender's personal safety;
    (6) Whenever used by any person to prevent a mentally ill, mentally incompetent, or mentally disabled person from committing an act dangerous to any person, or in enforcing necessary restraint for the protection or restoration to health of the person, during such period only as is necessary to obtain legal authority for the restraint or custody of the person.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  6. #5
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    So an incredibly liberal state like Washington has legal provisions in place to protect citizens when having to deal with scum in a forceful way.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by nca_mm View Post
    So an incredibly liberal state like Washington has legal provisions in place to protect citizens when having to deal with scum in a forceful way.
    But it still does not allow the legal use of force to stop them from fleeing empty handed - unless you are absolutely sure that their crime was a felony and you were going to citizen's arrest them. Even then, deadly force would not be allowed, except in self-defense.

    Anyway, I just noticed this was posted specifically in the South Carolina forum, so I apologize for posting about WA law...
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  8. You have the right to defend your life, family or property under SC law however you cannot use deadly force if the perpetrator is fleeing. You also have to consider if the criminal offense is a misdemeanor or felony. As a cwp holder, you cannot present for a misdemeanor. You'll go to jail. And as the law implies, the burden of proof really falls to you. Obviously, if the perp is shot in the back of the head, you'd have one heck of a time proving you were in danger and feared for your life. Some things cops are good for but, Sheriff Chuck Wright said it best, " Remember when SECONDS count, the cops are just MOMENTS away." He was referring to life and death or great bodily injury situations. Stealing a vehicle or property where you're not in it, on it, or have physical possession of it(the item's in your hand)... You can't shoot. And firing warning shots is illegal in most counties and municipalities in this state.

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by hgk1979 View Post
    You have the right to defend your life, family or property under SC law however you cannot use deadly force if the perpetrator is fleeing. You also have to consider if the criminal offense is a misdemeanor or felony. As a cwp holder, you cannot present for a misdemeanor. You'll go to jail. And as the law implies, the burden of proof really falls to you. Obviously, if the perp is shot in the back of the head, you'd have one heck of a time proving you were in danger and feared for your life. Some things cops are good for but, Sheriff Chuck Wright said it best, " Remember when SECONDS count, the cops are just MOMENTS away." He was referring to life and death or great bodily injury situations. Stealing a vehicle or property where you're not in it, on it, or have physical possession of it(the item's in your hand)... You can't shoot. And firing warning shots is illegal in most counties and municipalities in this state.
    So, basically, you catch someone stealing from you, you're **** out of luck. Great. Just great.

  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by nca_mm View Post
    So, basically, you catch someone stealing from you, you're **** out of luck. Great. Just great.
    How badly do you want to shoot someone that you would make a thread about someone else lamenting the fact that he didn't get away with shooting a petty thief in the back? It's a pretty safe bet in every jurisdiction across this country that back-shooting is going to bring on scrutiny from law enforcement. That's not to say that back-shooting is illegal in every jurisdiction or every set of circumstances, but it's going to raise questions that aren't raised when a criminal is found dead in a position consistent with charging you and with two rounds front-center mass and one to the forehead.

    There is nothing consistent with The Constitution that promotes the idea that petty criminals should die for their petty crimes. Don't be so anxious to be judge, jury and executioner, and pray that you never get the "opportunity" to fulfill that anxiousness. You may end up facing the same kind of ruination that Mr. Methe is facing, which, even if a jury exonerates him, he will most likely end up owing his lawyers for the rest of his life, and maybe the family of the kid if they can win in civil court. There's a fine line between justified and unjustified, and if you're going to carry a gun, you damn well ought to know it and toe it.

    Blues
    No one has ever heard me say that I "hate" cops, because I don't. This is why I will never trust one again though: You just never know...

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by BluesStringer View Post
    How badly do you want to shoot someone that you would make a thread about someone else lamenting the fact that he didn't get away with shooting a petty thief in the back? It's a pretty safe bet in every jurisdiction across this country that back-shooting is going to bring on scrutiny from law enforcement. That's not to say that back-shooting is illegal in every jurisdiction or every set of circumstances, but it's going to raise questions that aren't raised when a criminal is found dead in a position consistent with charging you and with two rounds front-center mass and one to the forehead.

    There is nothing consistent with The Constitution that promotes the idea that petty criminals should die for their petty crimes. Don't be so anxious to be judge, jury and executioner, and pray that you never get the "opportunity" to fulfill that anxiousness. You may end up facing the same kind of ruination that Mr. Methe is facing, which, even if a jury exonerates him, he will most likely end up owing his lawyers for the rest of his life, and maybe the family of the kid if they can win in civil court. There's a fine line between justified and unjustified, and if you're going to carry a gun, you damn well ought to know it and toe it.

    Blues
    Agree with everything you just said. I just have no tolerance for folks trying to take what is another man's. These thieves know that if they just run, nothing will happen b/c of the "in the back" stuff you said. This is why I'd just like to know what a man can do to stop these types in the act. Certainly can rely on police to catch 'em.

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