Carry Question
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Thread: Carry Question

  1. Carry Question

    I knnow you can't carry into a resturant where Alcohol is served. Now what if its Sunday and my county doesnt allow sale of alcohol on Sunday.
    Then can I carry in that location? I would think so since Alcohol cant be served.
    SC GrassRoots Member.

  2.   
  3. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    South Eastern SC
    Posts
    24
    Negative. As written, the statute doesn't leave much wiggle room.

    Cheers,
    Richard

    SECTION 16-23-465. Additional penalty for unlawfully carrying pistol or firearm onto premises of business selling alcoholic liquors, beers or wines for on premises consumption.

    In addition to the penalties provided for by Sections 16 11 330 and 16 23 460 and by Article 1 of Chapter 23 of Title 16, a person convicted of carrying a pistol or firearm into a business which sells alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine for consumption on the premises is guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, must be fined not more than two thousand dollars or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.
    In addition to the penalties described above, a person who violates this section while carrying a concealable weapon pursuant to Article 4, Chapter 31, Title 23, must have his concealed weapon permit revoked.
    My Kimber I show to my friends. My Glock I show to my enemies.

  4. #3
    Short answer is NO you cannot carry.

    Long answer is the prohibition against carrying in places that serve alcohol by CWP holders may not stand up to a court test. The SC AG has recognized this and off the record advised LEOs not to make arrests in SC soley for violation of the carry law as he does not want to have to defend the law in court. Therefore as long as people think it is against the law they will for the most part obey it. However if a test case should go through the courts and be overturned then the word would be out.

    I have an opinion by the AG on this question and while he takes about 6 pages to state that it was the intent of the legislature he never actually says that it is absolutely illegal. The point is that we need a test case and hope you are willing to be that.

  5. #4
    I've read the above quoted law, and I can't figure out why you can't carry in there on Sunday.
    The establishment can't serve alcohol, so why not?

    I'm sure, as the two above post pointed out, there are lots of opinions and I'm probably wrong... but I'll say this, for what it's worth... I would.

    I find the whole law in itself insulting. I firmly believe our lawmakers have to be idiots. Must be a requirement for the job. Their whole reasoning is just plain stupid. I see why they made the law but what would have been much simpler would be to make it illegal to conceal carry while intoxicated. And would have actually covered a lot more ground and potential problems than just inside a restaurant or bar.

  6. I agree with you blume. I can see why not in a bar. But a resturant and as long as your not at the bar..
    SC GrassRoots Member.

  7. #6
    SECTION 16-23-465. Additional penalty for unlawfully carrying pistol or firearm onto premises of business selling alcoholic liquors, beers or wines for on premises consumption.
    In addition to the penalties provided for by Sections 16 11 330 and 16 23 460 and by Article 1 of Chapter 23 of Title 16, a person convicted of carrying a pistol or firearm into a business which sells alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine for consumption on the premises is guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, must be fined not more than two thousand dollars or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.
    In addition to the penalties described above, a person who violates this section while carrying a concealable weapon pursuant to Article 4, Chapter 31, Title 23, must have his concealed weapon permit revoked.
    I understand the confusion but the standard interpretation of the bolded portion is "The premisised of a business licensed to sell alcohol for on premisis consumption". Whether or not this is the actual legal interpretation or not is the one normally taken and means the entire premisis at any time which is even while it is closed, private parties etc. There is also some discussion about if it also includes the owner and employees. I will not get into that.

    Take special note of the underlined portions. This is the only place in the SC Code where it talks about carrying into a place serving alcohol. It says in addition to the penalties of Section 16-23-460.

    What does 16-23-460 say?

    B) The provisions of this section do not apply to:

    (1) A person carrying a concealed weapon upon his own premises or pursuant to and in compliance with Article 4, Chapter 31 of Title 23;
    So we have 16-23-465 saying in addition to the penalties of Section 16-23-460. Section 16-23-460 says there are no penalties for persons holding a CWP. Therefore there is no penalty for someone with a CWP carrying into an establishment that serves alcohol. Does that explain why the AG does not want a case to go before the SC Supreme Court on this?

  8. #7
    When I took my class for concealed carry one of the folks in the class was a manager of a local restaurant... which serves alcohol and he was going to carry while at work... but that is a different debate.

    When I read the above section of law that your referenced... I see the word 'selling'. To me (and for sure I'm not a lawyer, judge, english teacher or LEO) I read that as the present tense and present active, or how ever you grammatically define the word 'selling' which means it is going on at the moment. If the business is closed, can not sell on that day or if it is having a private party and the alcohol is free... then it is not selling. (the last one is very debatable)

    but then, just for a disclaimer, don't call me to get you out of the hoos gow.

  9. Interesting note. So who wants to be the Ginny Pig LOL..

    The laws are so confusing..


    I guess I will have to make more notes on the places like Pizza Hut. Cause I carried in there and that is what brought up my post. It was sunday and I when we left I paused before cranking up the car and said to the wife. Does Pizza Hut here still serve beer. I didnt recall seeing it on the menu but I remember when I was younger we went it and order pizza and a pitcher of beer. But they may nolonger sell it. I know some have stopped serving it.
    SC GrassRoots Member.

  10. #9
    My instructors told me if I was in the restraunt part (not the bar) and not drinking.....well.... it is better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6....Im not suggesting that anyone break the law but it is supposed to be concealed.....

    The only reason I say this is because I carry to protect my family and if thats wrong than the hell with it. Check this link out, and you will understand where Im coming from.

    Ted Nugent

  11. #10
    16-23-460 states that the provisions of 16-23-460 do not apply to those carrying pursuant to and in compliance with 23-31-4 (The concealed carry permit statute). Nowhere in 16-23-460 does it state that 16-23-465 does not apply to those carrying pursuant to and in compliance with 23-31-4. 16-23-465 is not mentioned anywhere in 16-23-460.

    16-23-465 procribes a $2000 fine and/or 3 years in prison for carrying a pistol or firearm into a business which sells alcohol for on premises consumption. Nowhere in 16-23-465 does it say that this restriction does not apply to concealed carry holders. Also note that a $2000 fine in the State of South Carolina is not realy $2000, it's $4025.

    I don't like the current law in the People's Republic of South Carolina, but it is clear and should not be violated just because I don't agree with it. I do think the law needs to be changed and have writen legislators to seek redress of this matter.

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