Bush Pardons Have Common Thread - Guns


Glockster20

Clinging to God and guns
He needs to pardon those two border agents, Compean and Ramos who were arrested, tried and convicted for doing their job!
 

LVLouisCyphre

Obama is a mack daddy!
Unfortunately with Senators like Lautenberg we won't see reasonable changes to the GCA of 1968.

Non-violent felons should automatically have their civil rights restored after five years of sentence completion.
 

NDS

New member
Unfortunately with Senators like Lautenberg we won't see reasonable changes to the Gun Control Act of 1968
Very true. Gun owners need to more aggressively target state offices.
Non-violent felons should automatically have their civil rights restored after five years of sentence completion.
Sorry, automatic revocation of rights should not exist. Gun ownership should be part of sentencing and done on a case-by-case basis. The 'cookie-cutter / one-size-fits-all' law and sentencing that has become so popular is immoral.
 

FreedomsAdvocate

New member
What we need is fewer felonies on the books...When a 19 year old has consensual sex with a 17 year old, that is a felony...Our problem is we have too many laws! We need fewer laws that have real meaning and are enforced.
 
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What we need is fewer felonies on the books...When a 19 year old has consensual sex with a 17 year old, that is a felony...Our problem is we have too many laws! We need fewer laws that have real meaning and are enforced.

I agree concerning the age differences for statutory rape. Some states do also and have changed their laws adding an age difference, 3 years as an average. However, when it comes to violent crimes (murder, forcible rape, etc.) I support banning ownership of guns since these individuals have already demonstrated they care nothing about the rights of others.
 

wuzfuz

New member
Bush Pardons

I totally agree with Glockster on Campeon and Ramos. Here are two Border Patrol officers who do their job, which, by the way is laid out for them. and they are prosecuted and imprisoned for doing it, while the scumbag wetback dope smuggler is allowed to run back and forth across the border as much as he wishes. something is terribly rotten in the state of Denmark, indeed. They have the functions of the criminal and the officer reversed here, and it needs to be corrected.
 

FreedomsAdvocate

New member
Originally Posted by ronwill:
I agree concerning the age differences for statutory rape. Some states do also and have changed their laws adding an age difference, 3 years as an average. However, when it comes to violent crimes (murder, forcible rape, etc.) I support banning ownership of guns since these individuals have already demonstrated they care nothing about the rights of others.

That is what I mean when I say 'real meaning'. We need simple, straightforward laws that everyone can understand, and which are based on a definitive harm to an individual or group.

An example: North Carolina, sometime last year. Guy goes in to rob a convenience store. Shoots himself in the balls with a M1911 before he even gets into the store. He is charged with--if I recall correctly--7 different charges, including--get this--Using 'a weapon of mass-destruction'. An M1911?

We have felonies for prostitution, use of pot, everything else under the sun. Why? These are victim-less crimes and they are felonies. We are MAKING criminals. If society does not like something, and they think they need the state-exclusive use of force to enforce it, then maybe make it a misdemeanor, but most are felonies.

We have over 65,000 pages of just Federal laws. Most all are felonies. Too many laws simply makes more criminals. Something legal last year is illegal this year. Do we really 'discover' that many more crimes each year?

Sorry to go on a rant....:mad:
 
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Glockster20

Clinging to God and guns
I totally agree with Glockster on Campeon and Ramos. Here are two Border Patrol officers who do their job, which, by the way is laid out for them. and they are prosecuted and imprisoned for doing it, while the scumbag wetback dope smuggler is allowed to run back and forth across the border as much as he wishes. something is terribly rotten in the state of Denmark, indeed. They have the functions of the criminal and the officer reversed here, and it needs to be corrected.

Below is a link to a petition that I have already signed.

Two U.S. Border Patrol Agents are serving decade long
prison terms for attempting to apprehend a known drug
smuggler for illegally crossing our border with more than
700lbs. of drugs!

Almost as outrageous is that the illegal alien drug
smuggler, who was given free medical care, and immunity
for testifying against the agents is now suing the U.S. for
$5 million--claiming his civil rights were violated!

I have just signed a petition calling for the President
to pardon these two Border Agents and I'm asking you to
join with me by clicking here for the full story and the petition:

GrassFire.org - Real Impact Online.
Thanks!

Glockster.
 

tattedupboy

Thank God I'm alive!
He needs to pardon those two border agents, Compean and Ramos who were arrested, tried and convicted for doing their job!

Let's not forget that they made things worse for themselves by trying to cover it up. It wasn't the shooting for which they were imprisoned, but rather, for trying to cover it up, which they shouldn't have. What were they trying to hide?
 

gdcleanfun

Banned
I'm questioning the agents and the prosecutor...

I'm not defending them, nor am I thinking that they were wrong. I'm just posting part of an article that explains (somewhat) why they were tried and convicted. Seems to me that there is more to this story than meets the eye...



---
From this website:

...
At trial, Assistant U.S. Attorney Debra Kanof told the court that the agents had violated an unarmed Aldrete-Davila's civil rights.

"The U.S. Supreme Court has ruled it is a violation of someone's Fourth Amendment rights to shoot them in the back while fleeing if you don't know who they are and/or if you don't know they have a weapon," said Kanof.

Kanof dismissed Ramos' testimony that he had seen something shiny in the smuggler's hand, saying that the agent couldn't be sure it was a gun he had seen.

Further, Kanof argued, it was a violation of Border Patrol policy for agents to pursue fleeing suspects.

"Agents are not allowed to pursue. In order to exceed the speed limit, you have to get supervisor approval, and they did not," she told the Daily Bulletin.

Those shell casings Compean picked up were described to the jury as destroying the crime scene and their failure to file an incident report – punishable by a five-day suspension, according to Border Patrol regulations – an attempted cover up.

The Texas jury came back with a guilty verdict. Conviction for discharging a firearm in relation to a crime of violence has an automatic 10-year sentence. The other counts have varying punishments. Ramos and Compean will be sentenced next month.

"How are we supposed to follow the Border Patrol strategy of apprehending terrorists or drug smugglers if we are not supposed to pursue fleeing people?" said Ramos, who noted that he only did on that day what he had done for the previous 10 years. "Everybody who's breaking the law flees from us. What are we supposed to do? Do they want us to catch them or not?"

He also noted that none of the other agents who had responded to the incident filed reports that shots were fired and, besides, both supervisors at the scene knew they had discharged their weapons.

"You need to tell a supervisor because you can't assume that a supervisor knows about it," Kanof countered. "You have to report any discharge of a firearm."

"This is the greatest miscarriage of justice I have ever seen," said Andy Ramirez of the nonprofit group Friends of the Border Patrol. "This drug smuggler has fully contributed to the destruction of two brave agents and their families and has sent a very loud message to the other Border Patrol agents: If you confront a smuggler, this is what will happen to you."
...
 
G

gpbarth

Guest
Google "9-11 conspiracy" and then post something up here about how the US government was behind the attacks. Thanks to the internet, I can find the stories that I want to read, and the truth that I want without worrying about facts.

FACT: Ramos and Compean were in the process of apprehending a known felon and drug smuggler, who was in the process of committing another crime inside the US. HELLO! That is their job!

FACT: the smuggler was granted immunity from prosecution in return for testifying against Ramos and Compean. An illegal alien drug smuggler is asked to testify against two US Border Patrol agents? AND let off the hook when he does?

FACT: the same smuggler had a long record of previous offenses, and was in fact arrested again AFTER the Ramos/Compean incident, for doing the same thing.

FACT: the same smuggler is suing the US government (the same government who let him off the hook in return for his testimony) for his injuries and his arrest.

NOW: are you still whimpering desperately for this poor miscreant, so shabbily treated by the brutish Border Patrol, and are you glad that both men have been in solitary since they were arrested, treated worse than those who they tried to arrest? Next time you need a Border PAtrol agent, try calling the local Mexican drug smuggler for help instead. You know, those nice guys who profit from drugs, and human smuggling when they're not raping and murdering each other.
 

Scarecrow

New member
I totally agree with Glockster on Campeon and Ramos. Here are two Border Patrol officers who do their job, which, by the way is laid out for them. and they are prosecuted and imprisoned for doing it, while the scumbag wetback dope smuggler is allowed to run back and forth across the border as much as he wishes. something is terribly rotten in the state of Denmark, indeed. They have the functions of the criminal and the officer reversed here, and it needs to be corrected.

I agree.. what a crock.
 
W

wolfhunter

Guest
Glockster, thanks for the link and opportunity to help.
 

tattedupboy

Thank God I'm alive!
No one has yet answered what the agents were trying to hide by not reporting the incident, which they should have but didn't. Please understand that I'm not taking the side of the drug smugglers, but if we're going to discuss this, we need ALL the facts, not just those that bolster our own arguments.
 

PascalFleischman

New member
No one has yet answered what the agents were trying to hide by not reporting the incident, which they should have but didn't. Please understand that I'm not taking the side of the drug smugglers, but if we're going to discuss this, we need ALL the facts, not just those that bolster our own arguments.

"Cover Up" - they picked up their casings and didn't report the shooting until after their shift.

Compare that to the following:

Prosecution surpressed expert testimony explaining Davila's bullet wounds & how the entrance/exit wounds are consistent with a man turning towards them as he ran away. The agents claim Davila was shooting back towards them.

Ramos & Compean are serving prison sentences in Federal Maximum Security prisons with large Mexican populations.....they are in solitary confinement for their "safety"

Any reference to Davila being in the U.S. as a drug trafficker was surpressed. The fact that the vehicle he was driving that day was loaded with 700+ lbs of marijuana was surpressed. The fact that he was subsequently arrested AGAIN, before the trial, was surpressed.

The U.S. prosecutor is notorious for prosecuting "civil rights violations" of illegal Mexicans, under orders from the Mexican Consulate, not the U.S. DOJ.

Davila was given immunity, free health care, a FREE, no-questions-asked border crossing pass, and is currently suing the US Border Patrol for a 7-figure settlement for his injuries....injuries incurred during the commission of a FELONY.

Davila is currently serving a long prison sentence for the same activity in which he was involved the day he was shot.

Please tell me who was wronged and who covered up more.
 

tattedupboy

Thank God I'm alive!
I will confess that the alleged cover-up seems relatively tame compared to what the drug dealers were doing. Furthermore, I don't think anyone, myself included, ever follows protocol for their jobs 100% of the time. If there's a lesson to be learned from this, it's that incidents like that need to be reported in a more timely manner. They deserve to be pardoned.
 

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