It is recognition. Just because a State is on the NV DPS recognition list does not mean you can carry in the listed State with a NV CFP. Case and point NE; you cannot legally CCW in Nebraska on a NV CFP as of yet because there is no provision for recognition or reciprocity in that State. NE CHPs do meet with the statutory requirements with ratification from the NSCA and NV DPS.
If that's indeed the case then why the NV DPS recognition page titled as "Out of State Carry Concealed Weapon Permit Recognition"?I'm petty sure that is reciprocity.
No that is up to the individual state codes, in Mi your Nv permit is valid, just as my Mi permit is now valid in Nv when the AG's got togeather and each state recognized the other permit system and allows carry in their state that is reciprocity.The law does not allow a NV CFP holder to necessarily carry in a State that is on the NV DPS recognition list. Fortunately the only present exception is Nebraska which has no recognition or reciprocity whatsoever.
Get a NV CFP and tell a NE LEO you're carrying on a NV CFP since according to you we have reciprocity. We'll see how quickly you become a product of the NE correctional system. I'm a gambling man, I'll pay you five grand if you can legally carry on a NV CFP in NE as of the current NE CCW laws since there is reciprocity by your definition.No that is up to the individual state codes, in Mi your Nv permit is valid, just as my Mi permit is now valid in Nv when the AG's got togeather and each state recognized the other permit system and allows carry in their state that is reciprocity.
the section refereed toSection 2 of this bill allows a person who is
not a resident of this State to carry a concealed firearm in this State if the person
has a permit to carry a concealed firearm issued by a state included in the list
prepared by the Department of Public Safety pursuant to
[Sec. 2. 1. Except as otherwise provided in subsection 2, a
person who possesses a permit to carry a concealed firearm that
was issued by a state included in the list prepared pursuant to
section 3 of this act may carry a concealed firearm in this State in
accordance with the requirements set forth in NRS 202.3653 to
202.369, inclusive, and sections 2 and 3 of this act.
2. A person who possesses a permit to carry a concealed
firearm that was issued by a state included in the list prepared
pursuant to section 3 of this act may not carry a concealed firearm
in this State if the person:
(a) Becomes a resident of this State; and
(b) Has not been issued a permit from the sheriff of the county
in which he resides within 60 days after becoming a resident of
3. A person who carries a concealed firearm pursuant to this
section is subject to the same legal restrictions and requirements
imposed upon a person who has been issued a permit by a sheriff
in this State.
accordance with Senate Bill 237 passed by the 2007 Nevada Legislature the State of Nevada will recognize the following States' CCW permit holders: Michigan (added May 9, 2008)
This law allows holders of valid permits from these states to carry a concealed weapon while in the State of Nevada. The permit must be in the possession of the issuee at all times while carrying a firearm.
I agree that the words have two different definitions but if you look at the part of the web page that says Reciprocity it takes you to the page that uses the word recognizers.As much as Dr. Phil is a crackpot, he doesn't have a valid point, some people don't get it and never will.
It's not my fault you can't differentiate between definition of recognition and reciprocity. Even your own State page uses the term recognition and not reciprocity.
CT, FL, ME NH, NV, UT & VA CCW Holder
I know that NV does not enter into reciprocity agreements from attending the post 2007 legislative session meeting in the Grant Sawyer building in Las Vegas NV sponsored by some pro-2A NV legislators and the NV Sheriffs' and Chiefs' Association. It was clarified by the panel of the Nevada Sheriffs & Chiefs Association it is recognition and not reciprocity. I have no doubt the push comes from the States wanting to be recognized in NV. That's how Florida ended up on the NV recognition list.I agree that the words have two different definitions but if you look at the part of the web page that says Reciprocity it takes you to the page that uses the word recognizers.
You need Reciprocity for recognition, without actually looking at the signed agreement that the AG's entered into you cannot say it is not reciprocity just because they use the word recognize on a web page.
I do not know your AG but I do know Mike Cox and when he says he signed a reciprocity agreement then it is that. States do not tend to "Recognize" with out someone giving a push and I can tell you that push came from the Michigan side and not the Nevada one.
Too bad you have to waste all that time and money maintain all those CCW permits from other states to be able to carry, maybe you should back a good pro State AG like we did.
Now there is a big part of your problem Never let the police decide how a law is interpreted! 99% of the time they will screw it up What is needed is for someone to submit a request for clarification through their Representative to your AG for clarification and a official definition.I know that NV does enter into reciprocity agreements from attending the post 2007 legislative session meeting in the Grant Sawyer building in Las Vegas NV sponsored by some pro-2A NV legislators and the NV Sheriffs' and Chiefs' Association. It was clarified by the panel of the Nevada Sheriffs & Chiefs Association it is recognition and not reciprocity. I have no doubt the push comes from the States wanting to be recognized in NV. That's how Florida ended up on the NV recognition list.
Unfortunately the term reciprocity is used very loosely. In TX, recognition is called a "unilateral proclaimation of reciprocity." You can have recognition without reciprocity. Look at AZ, LA and PA.
Two of mine aren't going to be renewed because they are no longer needed; FL and VA. The maintenance costs of the remaining of the remaining States I'm keeping are nothing. FL, NV and VA are the most expensive ones I have.
If you have such a pro-gun AG and legislature, why do you still have all of these stupid prohibited areas we don't in NV? I travel frequently and with perhaps the exception of Louisiana; I see States with legalized gambling with casinos as a prohibited area for CCW, laugh and say, "I'm from Vegas, you call that a casino?" :icon_razz:
That is absolutely correct, you don't know how NV is.Now there is a big part of your problem Never let the police decide how a law is interpreted! 99% of the time they will screw it up What is needed is for someone to submit a request for clarification through their Representative to your AG for clarification and a official definition.
Police can only have opinions, but too often we are willing to accept what they say as law, no the street is not the place to argue with them there are proper avenues for that, in short Lawyer up.
Unfortunately every state has a bar and it's own version of an exam that is why each lawyer is only licensed to practice in the state they are certified in, this is why Definitions and how laws are interpreted can and do vary state by state, kind of like the famous Clinton quote "That depends on what your definition of is, is."
Not sure how NV is
The NV AG is the chief LEO of the State and represents the State in legal matters. However, the AG cannot violate statute. If authority has been delegated to an entity by statute (which it has in Nevada) then the AG must abide by that. The NV AG is also prohibited, as in many States, from providing legal advice to the general public; this is the case for the NV AG.but I bet it is the same as it is here here, your AG only interprets and enforces the law, which can be a real POS like our last one that actually spent state funds and took money from anti gun groups to fight the enactment of our "Shall issue" law, or they can be aggressive n help like Mike has. I also bet you have your anti legislators that have been elected by an ignorant section of the populace (like we have in the Detroit area) that decide on who they are going to vote for by the race card alone.
When our Shall issue law was first enacted you could not even carry in a pizza hut because they served beer, but it was a step in the correct direction, over the years we have put a choke hold on the CEZ (criminal empowerment zones) and have been removing them one at a time.
That is absolutely correct, you don't
Assemblyman Settelmeyer was at the NSCA CCW public meeting as well who was a sponsor of SB237. Nevadans, CCW instructors who attended and the NCSA CCW subcommittee were in attendance.
In Nevada, Sheriffs and Police Chiefs set the training standards and whether or not by vote if if a given State's CCW will be recognized in this State by statute. It was the only way we were going to get recognition in this State because a chronic thorn in our backside known as Bernie Anderson who is the Chair of the Nevada Judiciary Committee. He has the power on whether or not to table bills or allow the committee to vote. He has literally shot down recognition and reciprocity. He is also the reason why NV CFP applicants still have to qualify for specific semi-auto pistols.
That is how it is done in Nevada for recogntion. If you want additional clarification, you can request a copy of the NCSA post 2007 legistative session CCW meeting from Frank Adams who is the Executive Director of the NSCA, Nevada Assemblyman Settelmeyer or Nevada State Senator John Lee. I'm sure they can provide the video for you or give you information on how to get it. It is available in accordance to the Nevada open meeting law.
In the following shall issue States the issuing law enforcement agencies have jurisdiction and can practice administrative rules on recognition, reciprocity, certified instruction or the CCW program itself;Oh I understand your state is totally messed up and prime of a major law suit the first time they try something stupid, I said it before and I will reiterate it for you one more time NEVER LET THE POLICE MAKE OR DECIDE LAW THEY WILL SCREW IT UP 99% OF THE TIME ESPECIALLY THIS SO CALLED CHIEF'S ASSOCIATION!!! they are neither qualified, trained om, or sufficiently knowledgeable of the law, all they have is and can render are opinions and that is not law, that is what the lawyers and legislators are for! All it will take is one person with too much money and time on their hands and your state will loose a pile of money.
There is a legal term for this and I butcher it each time I try and spell it but it is based in Latin phrase which I stink at, but it involves when someone makes up a law and you believe it therefore giving it power, and you not believing it and challenging it rendering it void, n this is what your so called chiefs associations is doing.
Kick your legislator in the rear for being a lazy bunch and take back your laws before it gets any more messed up.
Don't know about the rest of the states but not in Michigan, although the Detroit area tried it and lost in court, when our shall issue system was first placed into effect.In the following shall issue States the issuing law enforcement agencies have jurisdiction and can practice administrative rules on recognition, reciprocity, certified instruction or the CCW program itself;
- AR: Additional administrative requirements. State police certifies instructors. Arkansas State Police also requires that a new resident that holds a recognized or reciprocal CCW surrender it to be issued an AR CHL.
- AZ: Arizona DPS certifies instructors and also enters into reciprocity agreements.
- CO: County sheriff certifies instructors.
- CT: Local agency issuing temporary permit for residents can add additional requirements even though it is illegal per CT BFPE.
- ID: County Sheriff certifies instructors. ID is may issue at 18, shall issue at 21.
- IN: Chief LEO of agency accepting the initial application (in applicant's place of residence or employment) can add arbitrary additional requirements.
- LA: Louisiana State Police certifies instructors and has the authority to enter into reciprocity agreements. They are also charged with verifying mutual recognition.
- NC: County sheriff certifies instructors.
- ND: Application requires chief LEO in the jurisdiction you reside (resident or non-resident) to sign off on the application.
- NE: State patrol certifies instructors.
[*]MI: County gun board can add additional requirements of applicants (i.e. mandatory appearance or interview).
- MO: County or City of St Louis Sheriff certifies instructors.
- NV: NV Sheriffs & Chiefs Association has control over the training curriculum, instructor certification and recognition.
- OR: May issue for non-resident CHLs.
- PA: County Sheriff or City of Philly can arbitrarily set reference requirements. Centre County does not have any reference requirements.
- SC: SLED is responsible for establishing reciprocity agreements and certifying instructors. SLED is not very receptive to the CCW program to begin with and think only LEOs should carry.
- UT: BCI certifies instructors.
- VA: County may add optional requirements; i.e. fingerprinting or an interview with the county sheriff of local PD.
I keep my eyes on what's happening nationwide since I am a traveling CCW instructor. NV isn't the only State with issues or where the issuing agency has some control over administrative regulatioins and procedures over the CCW program. Biggest control is training certification, recognition and reciprocity. The MI county gun boards need to go. Another issue is having to be a resident for a period of time before applying with no grace period for your prior CCW. Think I'm going to move to MI? No. I'll move to FL, NH, another part of NV or WY first. I'll only reside in States that have no State income tax and have some method where I can legally CCW prior to me establishing residency and are legal class III/NFA States.
Same thing happend in the City of St Louis and St Louis County when MO went shall issue; your point is? That was, however, easy to fix. MO residents in the City of STL and STL County would just get a Florida or Utah since MO is a we honor all State with no residency requirement.Don't know about the rest of the states but not in Michigan, although the Detroit area tried it and lost in court, when our shall issue system was first placed into effect.
Cities, Counties, and other municipalities can make no gun laws or ordinances, that right is reserved for state government, yes they tried and again it was in the Detroit area and again they got slapped in the face in court. are you seeing a pattern yet?
Dont you just love it when the ant's have to eat crow! on the downside someone had to spend the money to fight it in court, In our case it was our main grass roots group that had the pockets. At least our new castle law puts that burden on the BG N it should be the same for a incidence like this, they are wrong, they know they are wrong, the law says they are wrong, but the put up a fight and hope you will not.Same thing happend in the City of St Louis and St Louis County when MO went shall issue; your point is? That was, however, easy to fix. MO residents in the City of STL and STL County would just get a Florida or Utah since MO is a we honor all State with no residency requirement.
Can you vouch for every county in MI? I highly doubt it. You can only vouch for your county as you personally have gone through the process. I have also heard of MI CPL applicants just receiving a call from the gun board or clerk to pick up their license without an interview. How is that uniform? Have you heard of abuses by the various county gun boards? I have, WACO being the highest incident of abuses. WACO is also the most dangerous county in the US to live in per the FBI UCR. The gun board interview is an optional process which varies from county to county. How much power does a MI county gun board have? Probably quite a bit.
When you get things less screwed up as they are here in NV, I'll considering visiting my relatives on my father's side who predominately live in Jackson County MI. States that have an asinine laundry list of prohibited areas I tend to avoid.